tv Early Start With John Berman and Christine Romans CNN July 21, 2014 2:00am-3:01am PDT
with bombs. overnight, united nations declare it is concerned over the escalating violence. the u.s. secretary of state, john kerry headed to the region right now, attempting to broker a cease-fire. we are live on the ground in gaza with the latest. good morning, everyone. welcome to "early start." i'm john berman. >> i'm christine romans. it's monday, july 21st. 5:00 a.m. in the east. we welcome all the viewers here in the u.s. and around the world. grotesque is the world john kerry used to describe the pro-russian rebels removing the bodies from the wreckage of flight 17. they are piling the corpses into refrigerated rail cars. the russian president, vladimir putin insisting this disaster should somehow unite the international community, not divide it. secretary of state, john kerry, slamming what he calls the drunken separatists controlling
the crash site. the same separatists claiming they have the jet's flight data recorders. blasting russia for the bloody gorillas controlling the crash site. i want to bring in ivan watson in ukraine. what is the latest there now four days after this crash, what is the latest on the ground politically and in terms of securing the crash site? >> reporter: the latest is coming from the dutch government, which confirms several dutch forensic experts reached the torres train station near the crash zone where more than 100 of the victim's bodies are being stored in train cars. they are then expected to travel on later to the crash zone. in the meantime, and i have to add, it is the netherlands that has suffered the biggest loss in this disaster with more than 100 dutch citizens who were killed
aboard this flight. in addition, ukrainian prime minister announced dozens of international experts landed at the ukrainian city that includes a number of dutch experts as well as germans, australians, americans, british experts who are presumably going to be headed also toward the crash zone if the way is clear and safe for them. to get there, they have to cross front lines as we did going between ukrainian military check pounlts and separatist check points and fighting does continue to rage to the north of the city i'm in now, a rebel held city. we have heard clashes taking place with the separatists saying that ukrainian military forces, tanks have tried to
advance in the direction of the train station here. meanwhile, the ukrainian prime minister used harsh words against the rebels. no surprise since the war has been going on three months now, describing how he's been forced to negotiate with them trying to get access for investigators and emergency workers to the crash zone. take a listen to an excerpt from a press conference in kiev. >> those who committed this international crime, those responsible will be held accountable and together with the entire international community we will bring to justice everyone responsible. >> reporter: we are just hearing now, to remind you, christine of the situation here, the rumble of distant artillery.
this is still an active conflict zone. people are still dying, including at least two civilians killed in the last day of fighting in the nearby rebel held city. the rebels deny allegations they shot down flight mh17. they also have not handed over what they describe as technical devices. it could be the black boxes that are still not in the hands of the ukrainian government four days after flight 17 went down. >> how much influence do you think vladimir putin has? he made the statement overnight, breaking his silence saying this shouldn't be used to divide the international community, but to unite it. many of us say slood mir putin is dividing the international
community. >> reporter: clearly a number of world leaders believe he does have immense influence over the rebel that is control this part of eastern ukraine. the german chancellor, angela merkel had him use that pressure. the dutch prime minister, as well. they have all lined up to urge russia to take steps here. the australian prime minister saying he's hearing the right words from putin, but it has to be followed up with actions as well. as you mentioned, putin broke his silence sunday night. called it a tragic event. he appealed, said international experts from the civil aviation organization should be on the scene coordinating the investigation at the crash site but he also issued a warning saying that different parties shouldn't be trying to get some kind of political advantage of this tragedy. when you ask the rebels themselves, hey, are you getting
help from moscow, they are kind of coy about that. meanwhile, the ukrainian government says, accuses moscow of arming, training the rebels. those are accusations backed by the u.s. government and the australian government openly accusing the rebels of using russian supplied surface-to-air missiles to shoot down the airliner thursday, charges the rebels have denied. >> ivan watson live for us. thank you. 298 souls, the majority dutch. get those bodies out of there, a desperate plea of a mother. her son and his girlfriend were aboard the flight. they were pleading to allow access to the crash site. so many of us sickened by the thoughts of what's being done to their loved ones.
drew is trying to stay strong after losing his brother and sister-in-law on flight 17. >> it's difficult to lose loved ones. we are hurting a lot. we also feel very comfortable about the fact we think they are in a better place. we are going to go to church. it's going to be tough. we are going to have all these people. it's very difficult when it becomes personal. >> so much of the grieving being done in the netherlands where they lost so many loved ones on that flight. erin joins us by phone. what are you seeing and hearing on the ground dpr the families? >> reporter: a team of forensic experts just arrived in eastern ukraine, dutch forensic experts according to the dutch foreign ministry. we are checking on the train and they say they expect to have no problems in getting access to the crash site later today.
it's certainly a welcome development for families of victims here in the netherlands. we have been hearing calls of outrage and anger. they are very aware of the media reports coming out of that crash site area of looting and body snatching. i spoke to one woman who lost her son and his girlfriend to mh17. her son was 23 years old. they were going on holiday to bali. she purchased the ticket to help the girlfriend get over the loss of her mother. she lost her two and a half months ago. she wants to bury her son. she said it's her human right. listen to what she had to say. >> mr. putin, take care of my son and my daughter to bring them home. >> who knows where they are. who knows where the bodies are. where did they take them?
where did they take them? >> reporter: do you have any idea where they bodies are? >> no idea. >> maybe they took it. maybe it's there. maybe it's in one piece, maybe 1,000 pieces. >> no one knows. >> reporter: one of many stories, one of many families affected here in the netherlands. i spoke to another mother who lost not one, but two sons on board mh17. she looked at me and said i wish it was me on that plane. families here very much united in outrage and anger. there's a tremendous sense of grief and loss felt in the netherlands. they want the body to be returned back home as soon as possible. john? >> the families need to be able to grieve the way they should be able to grieve. erin, thank you so much. the flight data recorders could be critical in terming who shot
down flight 17 and the role russia may have played in the situation. pro-russian separatists announced they recovered the black boxes with officials. seized them on orders from russia. >> there's criticism at malaysia airlines for flying over ukraine. they insist proper protocol was followed. >> malaysia airlines does follow advice from the international civil aviation authority on what are safe corridors to fly and altitud altitudes. we have flown it for quite some time. obviously, now that that happened, we will be reassessing that. >> dutch officials announced a team of forensic experts has arrived at the crash scene as reported. if that forensic team expects full access. we want to go to london and bring in our next guest,
aviation consultant, alister. thank you for joining us. how important is it to have them on the scene? they are expected to have access to the site later today. >> well, it's vitally important but it's not just important they are allowed access. they have to have continued access and have to secure the crash site. you can't have people tampering with the evidence and taking away bits to different locations. we know from the past there will be souvenir hunters amongst the rebels themselves. all this compromises the investigation into this accident. i assume it was an accident being shot down seems unlikely it was deliberate. the point is, it is so important that everything there on the ground is left untouched and for the investigators to have free
access. >> you know, unfortunately, four days in, practically, already it has not been left untouched. the bodies have been moved. they are now in refrigerated rail cars in cases. some of the debris has been touched and tampered with, some looting already. what has been lost at this point in terms of the investigative possibilities? >> the most important part, the copy of the black boxes as they are referred to in the media. those two items are absolutely critical to any investigation. it is absolutely essential they are returned to the ukrainian government itself or to the americans or the british or, you know, another independent nation that is able to analyze them properly. as for the bodies, they also are part of the investigation.
you know, i find it difficult to overly criticize the collection of the bodies and putting them in bags and moving them to refrigerated units. if they don't do that, it becomes a far greater problem. >> sure. >> so, i would be careful on the criticism that is on the recovery even if it is done by the rebel side. >> thank you so much for joining us. i think so much of the criticism is not on the recovery, but it took so many days. >> lack of transparency. the families are not taken into account, their needs and right to dignity for their loved ones. >> there are many people there on the ground, locals, miners. something needs to be done there. >> we are following the latest developments on flight 17. first, the deadliest day in
gaza. more troops moving in. two americans among those killed. we are live with what's new overnight after the break. thank ythank you for defendiyour sacrifice. and thank you for your bravery. thank you colonel. thank you daddy. military families are uniquely thankful for many things, the legacy of usaa auto insurance can be one of them. if you're a current or former military member or their family, get an auto insurance quote and see why 92% of our members plan to stay for life. nineteen years ago, we thought, "wow, how is there no way to tell the good from the bad?" so we gave people the power of the review. and now angie's list is revolutionizing local service again. you can easily buy and schedule services from top-rated providers. conveniently stay up to date on progress. and effortlessly turn your photos into finished projects
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another huge story developing. the deadliest da in gaza. 13 soldiers and 96 palestinians, many of them civilians killed on sunday. two casualties on the israeli side share american citizenship. one from california and one from texas. secretary of state, john kerry calling for a cease-fire inposs. despite the deaths of innocent palestinians, prime minister benjamin netanyahu showing no sign of backing down. >> i'm very sad. when i see that, we are sad.
we are sad for every civilian casualty. they are not intended. this is the difference between us. they hit civilians and hide behind them. >> i want to bring in karl. we have seen more explosions behind you. this is only intensified. >> reporter: absolutely. we have to warn all wars are dirty, but this is dirtier than most. right now, the casualties the gaza militants inflicted on the israelis have, for the most part, been soldiers on the palestinian side. a very different picture. according to the united nations, between 70% and 80% of the injured are civilians. there's no let up in that across eastern gaza. all morning, we have heard israeli aircraft pounding and
heard artillery pounding. we have seen tanks marking positions and proceeding to pound them with tank fire. we don't know what the targets are. in general terms, what the israeli military is doing is shut down militant tunnels hamas used to borrow into northern israel and across the northern border with israel, i should say and also across the eastern border to wage war against the israeli military on its own turf. hamas not giving up the fight. that was clear, also, last night in a statement from the military wing. they are claiming they have taken prisoners and israeli soldier. there's no confirmation from the israeli military on that. if it's true, hamas will use this bargaining chip for military and political gain as they did in 2006 with the capture of an israeli soldier. that took more than five years
to broker, but ended up with more than 1,000 palestinians eventually being released from israeli prisons. we are going to look closely to see how israel responds, whether it looks to lower the tone of what it is doing in gaza to come to an agreement with hamas or simply it is going to step up and continue its campaign unabbated but certainly a lot going on in eastern gaza this morning. john? >> karl is on the ground in gaza. we appreciate you being there. here in this country, deadly wildfires burning out of control in washington state. nearly 1 million acres torched. more than 100 homes destroyed. will cooler weather bring relief? indra petersons is tracking the weather, next. it's about getting to the finish line. in life, it's how you get there that matters most. it's important to know the difference. like when i found out i had a blood clot in my leg.
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last week, still here. we are talking a lot of rain heading their direction. this is in addition to what they have already been seeing. up to the northeast, the conditions are getting nicer and warmer. a lot of mixed bags. >> i'll say. indra, thank you. a new development in the investigation of downed malaysian airline flight 17. chaos, controversy at the scene there. what russian president vladimir putin is now saying. he's breaking his silence overnight and why families of those on board are so outraged. live team coverage, next. the cadillac summer collection is here. ♪
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happening now, a compromised crash scene creating anger and frustration this morning. pro-russian separatists refusing to step aside as investigators try to figure out who shot down the flight. families furious over the way their loved ones are being treated. the world waits to hear what was recorded on the black boxes. we have live team coverage and the latest developments straight ahead. the bloodiest day in gaza. israel bombs more neighborhoods. the u.n. calling for an immediate cease-fire. secretary of state john kerry on his way to egypt to try to work out a deal. as we learn, two americans have been killed by hamas. we are live on the ground in gaza with the latest. welcome back to "early start." a busy monday morning. i'm christine romans. >> i'm john berman. 30 minutes past the hour. we welcome our viewers here in
the united states and around the world. a gruesome scene at the crash site in eastern ukraine. pro-russian rebels pulling bodies and storing them in refrigerated rail cars. outraged families are telling them to step aside. secretary of state john kerry calls this grotesque. they are refusing to surrender control of the crash site. the rebels now claiming they have recovered the jet liners flight data recorders. listen to the prime minister of ukraine moments ago slamming the pro-russian rebels for refusing to step away from the wreckage. >> i don't care about not rebels, but these russian-led gorillas. they are not rebels. i expect nothing from the russian government.
what they can do, they can supply weapons, they can send well trained agents, they can support these gorillas, but they have to stop. >> i want to bring in senior international correspondent, ivan watson live in ukraine where a war has been raging all around him all morning, it's important to note. ivan, we can hear the outrage in his voice. he is not alone. the outrage is growing from leaders around the world. >> reporter: that's right. but it is important to note the rebels have allowed increasing access. for example, dutch forensic experts arrived at the torres train station where scores of 100 of the dead are stacked in train cars and are expected to move on to the crash site later today. a team of dozens of international experts, most of them from the netherlands, that
suffered the biggest loss of life. more than 190 people dead aboard the flight as well as u.s., australian, british, german experts as well landed in a ukrainian government controlled city, five hours drive away from here. if it is safe, they will drive in this direction to start to investigate the crash site. the rebel leadership here in this rebel controlled city say international experts are welcome to come and join the investigation. their credibility being slammed. one of the voices coming out against them is the prime minister of australia, which lost 27 citizens last thursday, aboard malaysian air flight 17. take a listen. >> there's no doubt that, at the moment, the site is under the control of the russian backed
rebels and given the almost certain culpability of the russian backed rebels in the downing of the aircraft, having those people in control of the site is a little like leaving criminals in control of a crime scene. >> reporter: criminals in control of the crime scene. the australian prime minister saying he spoke directly to russian president vladimir putin asking him to apply pressure on the rebels to open up the investigation and to hurry up the process of getting the bodies to a place where experts can identify them and start to repatriot them to their home countries. the australian russian prime minister saying he's hearing the right words, but they have to be backed up by deeds. the russian president, in his own statement called this a tragic event. he warned people should not try to score political points off this tragedy. john? >> ivan watson live for us.
it seems you are reporting some progress at the scene of the accident, which would be a positive development. i suppose the real test is what happened to the flight data recorders. >> reporter: that's right. it's a bigamistry here. our own chris cuomo asked the self-declared prime minister of this region, where are the flight recorders. the prime minister responded somewhat coyly. he said we have technical objects. we are not aviation experts. we don't know if they are the black boxes. he's not letting us film these technical objects. four days after the plane went down, nobody knows where the black boxes are. >> the doubt goes to skepticism. thanks so much. grieving flight 17 family members are begging the russians
and rebels in eastern ukraine to give international teams complete access to the crash site. the thought of their loved ones pile sbood train cars too much to bear. pictures of children's books, too much to bear, at the crime scene. listen to drew from minnesota trying to stay strong after losing his brother and sister-in-law on flight 17. >> it's very difficult to lose loved ones. i'm not kidding saying we are hurting a lot. we feel confident about the fact we think they are in a better place. i'm going to go to church. it's going to be tough. i'm going to have all these people -- i can't do it now. it's very difficult when it becomes personal. >> personal for so this families. coverage continues with erin live from amsterdam. how are the families coping? you spoke with the family members who, i mean they are grieving and they are outraged.
>> reporter: they are coping as best they can, christine. i think the news coming from the dutch foreign ministry that a team of forensic experts has finally arrived in the region making their way to refrigerated trains and expect to have full access to the crash site later today. i think that is a welcome development for many of the families here in the netherlands. the dutch prime minister saying it is the country's number one priority to have the victims bodies identified so they can be given the funerals, the dignity they deserve. just yesterday, i was speaking to one mother. she was here at the airport. she was laying flowers, adjusted the makeshift memorial and signed a book of condolences. she lost her son, just 23 years old, and his girlfriend on board mh17.
she is well aware of the media reports of looting and body snatching coming from the crash site. she had this message for russian president, vladimir putin. take a listen. >> mr. putin, please take care of my son and my daughter. >> who knows where they are. who knows where the bodies are. where did they take them. >> i can do nothing but wait for their bodies. >> reporter: do you have any idea where your son's body and his girlfriend's -- >> no idea. >> maybe they took it. maybe it's there. maybe it's in one piece or maybe it's in 1,000 pieces. >> reporter: you can hear the anger, the outrage, the shock and confusion in their voices. she told me it is her human right to be able to bury her son. christine? >> thanks so much for that. it is so tough, so tough for those families. the coverage of who shot down
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vladimir putin, claiming the united states has been tracking a major flow of weapons into eastern ukraine for months. >> the russian president breaking hi silence saying quote, we have repeatedly called on all parties to stop the bloodshed. no one should have the right to use this tragedy to achieve selfish political objectives. to help us break down this statement from the russian president, let's bring in an analyst from ihs. how much pressure can vladimir putin put on the separatists to unwind what is happening there, allow international monitors to get in there and a semblance of investigation. you heard from the australian prime minister, angela merkel, the german chancellor, john kerry. a lot of foreign leaders are
saying, mr. putin, you must put pressure on here. >> i think it has somewhat worked, as we are heard reports the rebels have allowed some access to international investigators. it seems that it is working. of course, four days have passed and there's also concern that the evidence might have been tampered. that's a serious concern. we shouldn't overestimate putin and russian government control and influence over the rebels. i don't think it's 100%. of course it's significant. under the pressure, the russian president tried to do something as the international investigators managed to get into the crash site. >> i have been struck by the carefully chosen language vladimir putin used since this crisis broke the other day. he tried to place blame on
ukraine for the situation that allowed it to take place. however, he has not said that prorussian rebels did not shoot down this plane. he's made clear he's been very careful not to say it wasn't them. do you think that's the case and why do you think that might be? >> i think their main message is there has to be an investigation, an independent investigation that should decide who is actually responsible for the tragedy and the statement that we have heard is pretty much reflective of that position. at the same time, what is interesting is that he's insisting that there should be an effort to resolve their conflict, that all parties have to come together. in a nutshell, it goes back to the former russian position that a diplomatic solution has to be found. as for today, the events are
developing and ukraine forces are advancing on eastern ukraine cities held by rebels. >> thanks for being with us to help us analyze the situation. >> the rift deepens. >> indeed. >> the rift deepens. >> a lot going on this morning. let's see what's coming up on "new day." kate bolduan joins us now. >> we are going to continue this. the latest on the attack of mh17. a busy weekend, a lot happening there. right now, a tense game of finger pointing leaving so many families stuck tragically in the middle. 298 bodies in limbo. many of them placed in refrigerated train cars. where else can they be put? pressure is on putin to get them to allow international monitors in and other international organizations in to allow for an
independent organization to see what happened. chris is live in eastern ukraine. we are following the developments there. plus, looking at gaza. more than a dozen israeli soldiers were killed. the death toll climbing over 500. secretary of state john kerry is heading to the region. >> thanks so much, kate. talk to you soon. over the weekend, the deadliest day yet in gaza. more bombs falling as israel increases ground attacks. hamas shows no sign of letting up. we are live after the break. 3rd and 3. 58 seconds on the clock, what am i thinking about? foreign markets. asian debt that recognizes
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two americans are among the 13 israeli soldiers killed sunday in the deadliest day yet in gaza with nearly 100 palestinians reportedly killed. the death toll in gaza tops 500 after two weeks of intensifying violence. the american soldiers killed while fighting max from san fernando valley, california and shoun from south padre island, texas. secretary of state kerry calling for a cease-fire as soon as possible. israel is expanding the ground offensive. despite the deaths of hundreds of innocent palestinians, prime minister netanyahu is not
backing down. >> i'm very sad when i see that. i'm very sad. we are sad for every civilian casualty. they are not intended. this is the difference between us, the hamas deliberately target civilians and hides behind civilians. >> let's bring in karl with the latest developments on the escalating development. any side of an off ramp, karl? >> reporter: certainly not right now, christine. in fact, while you were in break, an israeli air strike went in about a half mile from our live position. seemed to be some kind of air strike with a large cloud of dust and smoke into the air. that is cleared now. but, this kind of stuff has been going on throughout the morning and throughout the night. a lot of fire this morning, again, concentrated in eastern gaza. at times, we see parts of the
skyline clear. buildings there are on fire. we have heard artillery and air strikes. from time to time, we can hear the rattle of assault rifles indicating that perhaps israeli forces and gaza militants are fighting it out hand-to-hand as well. the israelis are making their point saying they are coming this far into gaza to destroy the militant tunnels. that has not been successful. they have not been successful shutting down the tunnel. the israeli military and hamas saying hamas commandos burrowed into israel and engaged israeli forces in combat there. the other major development, really over night was the announcement by the brigades, the military of hamas claiming they have captured an israeli soldier in fighting earlier sunday. we are waiting confirmation from
the israeli military. they have not confirmed whether one of their soldiers is in the hands of has mmas. if it is true, they would use it to gain political and military leverage. think to 2006 when they captured an israeli soldier. it took more than five years to broker a deal, but ended up with more than 1,000 palestinians walking free from israeli prisons. certainly, that announcement proved popular with the civilian population. when that forecast was made on television, we heard spontaneous applause and cheering going up from the apartment blocks around the building. we have to see how that plays out on the battlefield. see what israel's response is and, of course, to follow closely to see whether to get independent confirmation of hamas' claims they have taken a prisoner. christine? >> stay safe, karl.
the other top story, malaysian airlines second disaster in four months. ahead, what can the struggling airline do when we get an "early start" on your money. wouldn't it be great if hiring plumbers, carpenters shopping online is as easy as it gets. and even piano tuners were just as simple? thanks to angie's list, now it is. we've made hiring anyone from a handyman to a dog walker as simple as a few clicks. buy their services directly at angieslist.com no more calling around. no more hassles.
their tickets. passengers can postpone their flights for free. the question, will the flights have any passengers? the company is not commenting and won't tell how many have canceled their flights. the travelers are fleeing the airline in large numbers. the turn around plan could mean bankruptcy. another possibility they may have to go private. certainly an up hill battle for the airline. one minute to the top of the hour. "new day" starts right now. >> we have breaking news live from the frinl resting we have breaking news live from the final resting place of mh 17. the u.s. and the world is ramping up pleasure on putin. new evidence as to who shot the plane down and the possible attempts to cover it up, the crash site controlled by rebel fighters, 298 bodies now in limbo, their memories and dignity at the mercy of a larger battle. we have hard questions for the
rebel leader as families and the world demand answers and action. also breaking, the deadliest day yet for both sides in the middle east crisis. two americans fighting for israel killed, and hamas claims an israeli soldier has been captured. u.s. secretary of state john kerry now en route to the region. can he calm the violence? wolf blitzer is live from jerusalem. >> this is the moment of truth for russia. >> a special edition of "new day" starts right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com it is hard to say good morning to you from where we are in this violent region of eastern ukraine. this is a place scarred by violence. we're surrounded by constant threat. a lot of media here as you see. a truck was just pulling in to pick up even more bodies that have been laying out her